[MonoDevelop] Comments on Stetic GU designer

[Lluis Sanchez]

El dl 05 de 06 del 2006 a les 09:44 -0500, en/na Tony Caduto va
escriure:
> > Is there a way to add it?  Why can't you let developers make their own
> > choice?  Isn't that part of what Linux and Open Source is about?
> >
> >
> >   
> I agree, if there are core developers reading this, please add the
> fixed container so those of us that are used to win32 development
> can have something that is similar.

I'm going to add it (I didn't notice it wasn't there), but not because
win32 developers can have something they are used to, but since it is
part of GTK.

If you want to build applications for GNOME, you MUST learn GTK's layout
model. It's a fundamental concept in GTK, and you need to know it if you
want to write good GTK code, and to be able to understand others
people's code.

> 
> I don't want to hear "You have the source" fix it yourself either, I am
> not a monodevelop hacker and by the time the learning curve is out of
> the way I would have wasted a ton of time, so let's not start the you 
> have the source thing. (I only mention this because every time I have 
> pointed out a shortcoming in a open source project someone will say it)
> 
> I am sorry(not trying to start a flame war) but the whole panel way of 
> building a GUI is not intuitive at all and makes designing a simple GUI 
> a huge pain in the rear. A better solution would be to have 
> anchor/alignment properties or something similar for the fixed panel, so 
> I can make a edit control resize if I want to, that's how it's done in 
> Delphi and VS.net. Also in Delphi I can put a panel and I can set 
> alignment properties if I want stuff to resize automatically, for 
> example I can put a panel and align it to bottom, add a splitter then 
> another panel and align that to client.  The fact that MonoDevelop tries 
> to force the whole panel thing is ridiculous.

I've been a win32 developer for many years (starting with Visual C++
1.52), tried several kinds of GUI designers, and it wasn't so hard to
learn the GTK model. It's not worse or better, it's just different.

Don't expect everything to work like what you already know (and please
don't classify it as ridiculous if it does not). Don't be lazy, open
your mind to new ways of doing things.

> 
> I love Linux and open source, but the development tools available pale 
> in comparison to Delphi or VS.net (Delphi is the best of course :-)  The
> only one that is close right now would be NetBeans 5.x, sorry the
> eclipse GUI builder stinks.
> 
> If Monodevelop is to be a success it needs to be easy to use, think VB 3 
> back in the early 90s.  without a doubt VB 3 is what led to the huge 
> popularity of windows.  The same thing could happen to Gnome and Linux.

I agree, MD needs to be easy to use, and it has to be easy to
experienced GTK developers as well as newcomers. We can't change the
layout model, but maybe we can change the designer to make it easier to
deal with the different types of containers. In any case, don't expect a
clone of the VS or Delphi designer, since those are based on different
layout models.

I'm open to suggestions about that. But please, before making any
suggestion, learn about GTK and try to understand why it is designed in
the way it is.

Lluis.