[Mono-osx] Menu Bar for Mac OS X?

Fri Apr 9 02:55:17 EDT 2010

Qt video presentation, 2009/03/04, More Native Look & Feel: Intro, Styles,
Style Sheets, Dialogs, Cross platform tips, Native platform tips:

http://qt.nokia.com/developer/learning/online/talks/developerdays2009/tech-talks/how-to-make-your-qt-application-look-native

I think it sounds promising.  Qt definitely seems serious about enabling
developers to create a native look and feel (for each platform) (especially
Windows, Mac, GNOME, KDE).

This makes me wonder whether Mono should focus more on Qt bindings (rather
than GTK+ / GTK# bindings)?

Guess I'm not sure yet if the other options (like Java Swing, Java SWT)
compete, but I think Qt sounds promising for Mac OS X support (for Aqua /
Cocoa).

On Wed, Apr 7, 2010 at 1:29 AM, Elfen <pem.accounts.spam at gmail.com> wrote:

> All Duane had to do was say he likes the app - and all of the sudden he was
> being credited as the author O:-)
>
> @Stifu: Apologies for the typo O:-)
>
>
>
>
> On Wed, Apr 7, 2010 at 1:23 AM, Stifu <stifu at free.fr> wrote:
>
>>
>> The Super Mario Kart editor is by me, not Duane, but whatever. :)
>>
>> By the way, you could also consider Java + Qt (Qt Jambi).
>>
>>
>> PemIam wrote:
>> >
>> > I feel like it might be an extremist (ie, fundamentalist) thing to
>> suggest
>> > that there is not any apps ever anywhere (in practice and in theory)
>> where
>> > it's justified to use a cross-platform GUI toolkit, rather than 3
>> separate
>> > (or 2 separate) native GUI toolkits.
>> >
>> > I gave two somewhat specific examples of internal tools.  One where most
>> > of the code is GUI code, yet the GUI widgets are all simple / basic (and
>> > not that different on Mac OS X).  The other example was just a front-end
>> > to a command line tool (where having a GUI at all is just a
>> convenience),
>> > where having a Mac version of the GUI at all is only because we think
>> it's
>> > better to do the "low hanging fruit" than to do nothing, to support the
>> > small minority of theoretical Mac users (who are all internal company
>> > teammates / coworkers).  Duane's hobby project Super Mario Kart track
>> > editor is an example.  Another obvious example is if you have a huge
>> > existing application that already relies on WinForms, and you just want
>> to
>> > port it to Linux and Mac - and you can justify a few months work (but
>> not
>> > a few years work).
>> >
>> > I realize that Joanna has given some good arguments for why, in certain
>> > situations, or in the ideal situation (the all things equal situation of
>> > infinite resources), it might better to consider using a native GUI
>> > toolkit for every platform.  However, I find it very extremist to
>> suggest
>> > that there is not ever any situation where a cross-platform GUI toolkit
>> is
>> > the right choice.  (As a side note, I think it's even more extremist to
>> > suggest that it's not possible to make a good cross-platform GUI
>> toolkit).
>> >
>> > There are cross-platform GUI toolkits, which are at least trying to
>> > support an Aqua look and feel for Mac OS X.  Apple supports Java, and
>> > seems to especially support Swing (as a viable path to meet their HIG)
>> > (I'm unclear about SWT).  Also, my impression of Qt is that it might be
>> as
>> > good - if not better (for Mac OS X Aqua support)?
>> >
>> > In fact, for some of these examples, I find it hard to believe that a
>> > cross-platform GUI toolkit would even be distinguishable from a native
>> GUI
>> > app toolkit.  What if the only GUI your app has is a textbox (for a file
>> > name) and a "Start" button?  Or maybe that plus a few common
>> > cross-platform widgets for options (like a pull-down menu, a few
>> > checkboxes, a few radio buttons)?  As Apple puts it in their "Java
>> > Development Guide for Mac OS X" doc, "With just a little work on your
>> > part, Java applications can be nearly indistinguishable from native
>> > applications".
>> >
>> > My original post to this topic was to ask for information about to what
>> > extent Mono / MonoDevelop / GTK# (or Qt / Qtoya?) is at the point where
>> it
>> > can really compete with the alternative options (for Mac OS X Aqua
>> > support, when writing a GUI application from scratch).  At this point,
>> my
>> > impressions are as follows:
>> >
>> > 0) Using a native GUI toolkit for Windows and Mac and Linux (or even
>> GTK#
>> > for Windows and Interface Builder for Mac) is a good option to consider
>> in
>> > many situations.  However, it is (too much extra work) and (would have
>> > negligible benefit) - for this one specific project
>> >
>> > 1) Mono, GTK#, MonoDevelop - I love them, but they are not the best
>> choice
>> > - this my one specific project
>> >
>> > 2) Java with Swing is supported by Apple.  SWT may be a viable
>> > alternative, but I'm unclear on that?  Not sure yet if the IDE would be
>> > Eclipse or NetBeans or some other IDE.
>> >
>> > 3) C++, Qt, Qt Creator - this sounds like it might be an even better
>> > option than Java
>> >
>> > 4) REAL Studio, sounds pretty cool, but nothing about it screams "much
>> > better Mac OS X Aqua support han Java and Qt", and it's not my top
>> choice
>> > - for this one specific project
>> >
>> > Overall, I think that either (Java with Swing, or SWT, not sure about
>> the
>> > IDE) or (C++, Qt, Qt Creator) sounds like my top two choices?
>> >
>> > thank you for any info
>> >
>> > ----- Original Message -----
>> > From: "Duane Wandless" <duane at wandless.net>
>> > To: "Stifu" <stifu at free.fr>
>> > Cc: mono-osx at lists.ximian.com
>> > Sent: Tuesday, April 6, 2010 2:31:56 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
>> > Subject: Re: [Mono-osx] Menu Bar for Mac OS X?
>> >
>> >
>> > I think this is a great app... and yes you are correct having a single
>> > cross platform UI would be very useful for this project.
>> >
>> >
>> > Your definition of cross platform does include the UI. And yes it would
>> be
>> > nice if there existed a C# cross platform UI that at least functioned as
>> > expected everywhere... even if the interface was not 100% standard on
>> each
>> > platform.
>> >
>> >
>> > On Tue, Apr 6, 2010 at 8:51 AM, Stifu < stifu at free.fr > wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Joanna Carter wrote:
>> >>
>> >> But, since you say the app is open source, where can I see it?
>> >>
>> >
>> > Here's my app: http://code.google.com/p/epicedit/
>> > You'll understand I can't make money with this (and don't want to even
>> if
>> > I
>> > could, anyway). So there is no market to capture. In the first place,
>> I'm
>> > making this for myself.
>> >
>> > I've talked to at least one Mac user who was very happy he could use it,
>> > although Mac-specific WinForms bugs got in the way
>> > ( https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=468420 ,
>> > https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=469194 ).
>> > It's a shame such major bugs don't get any attention.
>> > --
>> > View this message in context:
>> > http://n4.nabble.com/Menu-Bar-for-Mac-OS-X-tp1750710p1752770.html
>> >
>> > Sent from the Mono - OSX mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>> > _______________________________________________
>> >
>> >
>> >
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>> > Mono-osx at lists.ximian.com
>> > http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/mono-osx
>> >
>> >
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>> >
>> >
>>
>> --
>> View this message in context:
>> http://n4.nabble.com/Menu-Bar-for-Mac-OS-X-tp1750710p1753913.html
>> Sent from the Mono - OSX mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
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