[Mono-list] NET using Java VMs and libs

Christopher Nehren apeiron@prophecy.dyndns.org
26 Mar 2002 19:17:29 -0500

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On Tue, 2002-03-26 at 06:57, Niels Peter Strandberg wrote:
> Microsoft is "the evil Empire"!  ;-)

Believing this will get you nowhere fast. Believing some group or
company to be "evil" limits your ability to accept what they've done. In
fact, by subscribing to this theory, you're contradicting yourself by
using Mono at all -- since, really, it _is_ a (port of a) creation of
this _Evil Empire_, no?

> This is not about Sun vs Microsoft. This is not about Microsoft. . This=20
> is about not need to own the latest windows, or window att all. Isn't=20
> that what mono is all about, when they want mono to run on linux?

Agreed. But if this is so, why the line about the "Evil Empire" above,
even if it is in jest?

> If NET "is so good!" then it should excises on other platforms, and=20
> since there is a Java VM for almost every platform, then running NET on=20
> that would be great. Not because it is SUN and because MS "is the evil=20
> empire!" It will simply make good sense!

Agreed, except for the reasons stated below about why Java should not be
the sole .NET language.

> It is very hard to discuss this with some people, because all they can=20
> or "want to know" is Windows. They have invested maybe 1000-10.000  of=20
> hours on learning to do window programming, then it is very hard to=20
> start looking outside windows. But there is a beautyful world outside=20
> MS, full of wonderful OS'es.
> Java is a billion dollar industry. You have Application Servers, costing=20
> 10.000 of dollars, running hardware costing 100.000 dollars. So Java is=20
> not "the next greatest after NET". NET is still a baby compared to Java.=20
> Just because it dos not come from MS, dos not mean that it is bad!

The same "all they want to know is Windows", with your Java. Why limit
yourself to just Java? Further, as has been stated previously and will
be stated in the future, the _entire purpose_ of Mono -- aye, .NET as a
whole -- is to create a language independent development platform that
produces platform independent binaries. It really is the next generation
of computing. Limiting yourself to one language seriously hinders this
> So this should not be a discussion on "who is best", but how to make NET=20
> run on other platforms, and I think "with my limited knowledge of NET"=20
> that Java would be a good place to start the discussion.

So why are you basically saying "Java is the best for .NET"? If you
really are out for the best for .NET, you won't want to immediately
limit it to one language -- and thus immediately limit it's abilities to
that one language. Rather, you'll want to maintain the language
independent framework with which .NET was designed.
> C++ is an option, but is is not as easy to port to other platforms as=20
> Java.

I agree that Java can be easier to port than C++. However, C++ is older
than Java, and has thus been used for longer. But Java vs. C++ isn't the
issue. C# _is_ the issue. And again, as has been stated before and will
be stated again, the reasons .NET went with C# have been stated
previously and will be stated again. I know at least two of these. First
of which is the performance issue. The second of which is to actually
port .NET, and not modify it (.NET is done in C#, VB.NET, ASP.NET and J#
-- with which I'm not really familiar, but I surmise it's closer to Java
than even C#).=20

> I myself runs Win, Linux and Mac OS X. The win is only for games!

OK, so you run Windows, Linux, and Mac OS X.=20

Best regards,
Chris Nehren

Free your mind.
~ Morpheus, in "The Matrix"

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