[Mono-dev] Mono and ASP.NET vNext

Greg Young gregoryyoung1 at gmail.com
Thu May 15 17:41:33 UTC 2014 

That would make sense as the models are different. Also that libuv wrapper
from looking looks fairly promising.


On Thu, May 15, 2014 at 8:38 PM, Nikita Tsukanov <keks9n at gmail.com> wrote:

> I think we should have something like Mono.Sockets with abstraction of
> event loop and I/O code based on libuv or whatever, and build classes like
> HttpListener on top of it.
>
>
> 2014-05-15 21:30 GMT+04:00 Nikita Tsukanov <keks9n at gmail.com>:
>
> I suspect that having libuv behind socket code won't help much, since most
>> of socket performance problems are related to the fact that
>> BeginSend/Recieve, event loop and AsyncCallback run in different threads.
>> Because of that we have overhead even with simple
>> void ReadNext()
>> {
>>    _socket.BeginRecieve(buf, blablabla, res=>
>>    {
>>        _socket.EndRecieve(res);
>>        ReadNext();
>>    });
>> }
>> On windows that works fine because of IOCP behind that abstraction that
>> is designed to be used with thread pool. *nix platforms doesn't have
>> anything like IOCP, only epoll/kqueue, so for actual performance
>> improvement one have to use single-threaded approach (with round-robin
>> connection dispatch between workers), when all I/O operations and event
>> loop run in single thread.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> 2014-05-15 20:55 GMT+04:00 Miguel de Icaza <miguel at xamarin.com>:
>>
>> Hello,
>>>
>>> Well, i want to see a prototype, and then decide.
>>>
>>> So this needs to be done with some kind of peer framework where this is
>>> done.
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thu, May 15, 2014 at 9:29 AM, Greg Young <gregoryyoung1 at gmail.com>wrote:
>>>
>>>> Yes I would say moving both to libuv would be a good move :)
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Thu, May 15, 2014 at 4:22 PM, Roope Kangas <roope at grandcrugames.com>wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>
>>>>> On a tangent...
>>>>>
>>>>> It would be really nice if something like libuv would the thing behind
>>>>> Socket code.
>>>>>
>>>>> Could that be something to investigate?
>>>>>
>>>>> Mono could basically piggyback on nodejs development.
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Roope Kangas
>>>>>
>>>>> On 15.5.2014, at 15.00, Greg Young <gregoryyoung1 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> So the one issue I have seen with the libevent implementation is that
>>>>> it seems to perform very poorly in windows (+-5k hello worlds/second where
>>>>> as its closer to 100k/second in linux). From researching libevent they
>>>>> supposedly now use IOCP in windows and should be better but I have not been
>>>>> able to make this happen. It may also be worth looking at libuv which is
>>>>> pretty close to a drop in replacement for libevent as it seems to get much
>>>>> better performance in windows and similar performance in linux. @Nikita I
>>>>> will hopefully have some time next week and likely will send some more pull
>>>>> requests in relation to the memory allocation patterns.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Thu, May 15, 2014 at 6:56 AM, Miguel de Icaza <miguel at xamarin.com>wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hello Nikita!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Your approach looks fabulous!   I look forward to trying it out!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Miguel
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Wed, May 14, 2014 at 11:40 AM, Nikita Tsukanov <keks9n at gmail.com>wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I'll try to implement OWIN host on top of my libevent built-in http
>>>>>>> server ( https://github.com/kekekeks/evhttp-sharp ) since for now
>>>>>>> it's the fastest thing for handling HTTP-requests on Mono I know (now it
>>>>>>> has host implementation for NancyFx which we are using in production for
>>>>>>> half of a year).
>>>>>>> Although both evhttp-sharp and FastCGI servers like HyperFastCGI and
>>>>>>> Fos, are incapable of serving websockets (one because of underlying
>>>>>>> implementation, another because of limitations of FastCGI protocol), so it
>>>>>>> would be great to wrap something like
>>>>>>> https://github.com/kekekeks/evhttp-sharp which has websocket
>>>>>>> support and positioned as evhttp drop-in replacement.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>> Nikita
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 2014-05-14 19:29 GMT+04:00 Marcelo Zabani <mzabani at gmail.com>:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Wow! This is such great news!!
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> As for running Owin applications with Unix HTTP servers, I've
>>>>>>>> developed Fos <http://github.com/mzabani/Fos> on a very permissive
>>>>>>>> license and a focus on good documentation and running with Mono on *nix. I
>>>>>>>> would very much love getting contributions on this, because my spare time
>>>>>>>> is running lower these days.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hope it helps,
>>>>>>>> Marcelo.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Wed, May 14, 2014 at 12:44 AM, Miguel de Icaza <
>>>>>>>> miguel at xamarin.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Hello guys!
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Microsoft has open sourced ASP.NET vNext:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> http://github.com/aspnet/home
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> This is an entire new web stack that only needs the core of Mono
>>>>>>>>> (does not even use System.Web.dll!).
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> So these are of course great news, because (a) The core Mono has
>>>>>>>>> been in active development, and (b) that means that Mono's on the server
>>>>>>>>> can be used without all those pesky limitations that have been plaguing us
>>>>>>>>> for years.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> So we ran into a couple of limitations in Mono: some classes that
>>>>>>>>> they need are not implemented (I filed a bug, and a couple of Xamarin folks
>>>>>>>>> decided to take on that on their copious spare time) and we have a couple
>>>>>>>>> of bugs on FileSystemWatcher on OSX.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> But this is a great time to:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>    - Get involved with the github.com/aspnet project and submit
>>>>>>>>>    contributions that will make the software run on Unix.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>    - Look into technologies like Owin and Katana (sp?) and help
>>>>>>>>>    us have a story that plugs into Unix HTTP servers (the equivalent of our
>>>>>>>>>    bridge between Apache and mono: mod_mono, or our Fast CGI bridge to mono).
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>    - Take Mono's new profiling tools and performance counters for
>>>>>>>>>    a spin and help us fine tune the runtime to run .NET code faster on Unix
>>>>>>>>>    than you can on Windows.  While this is a tall order, my friend David
>>>>>>>>>    Miller would expect nothing less from us.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Hugs and love,
>>>>>>>>> Miguel
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>>>>> Mono-devel-list at lists.ximian.com
>>>>>>>>> http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/mono-devel-list
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>
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>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Studying for the Turing test
>>>>>
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>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Studying for the Turing test
>>>>
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>>
>
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-- 
Studying for the Turing test
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